I love the irony: a swimmer, in a non-Rev Olympic sport is who files the multi-billion $$ lawsuit against the NCAA. And just what does he think his damages are? (btw....I was a HS swimmer, so not bias by me)
As long as he can prove someone was willing to pay him for his NIL, he has a case. What really matters is that the case was recently granted class-action status, so this is about much more than just a swimmer now.
Ain't that the truth?! I have a friend who does medical class action and he has made a fortune. I think it sucks because he makes 30% and the rest goes to the plaintiffs, but split a thousand ways. He gets a third for just himself and his office. He has several homes and plays golf all day, now. LOL!!
True. And while I have no particular love towards attorneys, litigation isn't cheap. Especially when you are taking on a giant institution that has previously shown it is quite willing and able to drag cases through every level of the courts for years and years (even when it's likely they will lose). As a plaintiff, retaining the legal expertise on your side to take someone like that on is something you'll only get by agreeing that they will get a big cut of any damages you *might* be awarded. You might only walk away with peanuts in the end, but it's better than an empty hand.
I don't think the plaintiffs usually originate the big class actions. A law firm that specializes in liability class actions will spot a trend of injuries and then will advertise for plaintiffs to join the class. I have had several of those invitations (product liability, not medical). Also, the lead law firm usually syndicate the class action to pool resources and be able to market to the class nationally. A law firm does not go this alone. By syndicating, it is the plaintiff attorneys that have the advantage in resources. At the end of the day, it is the public that picks up the tab with higher product or service costs. This is one big reason American medical costs are way more per capita (20% of GDP) than other developed economies (Germany is next at 12%)
I'm sure all of us would prefer to be talking about sports, but I really appreciate your thorough nature on this subject. I feel as if you are reporting things that only you know, and I feel like an Insider as a result.
Keeping the Pac-12 Networks operational has to be a top priority for OSU and WSU. Properly managed, they'll provide a financial life raft for those two schools after getting absolutely F'd by the departing 10. The Pac-12 Networks' current production quality is better than the half-assed garbage put on by Fox or ESPN, and doesn't overbook itself with too many games. Leasing some of those services out to the departing 10 schools, or even the Big-12 conference, can be very advantageous.
Dec 12, 2023·edited Dec 12, 2023Liked by John Canzano
Agreed....someone has to produce the games they will sell or syndicate piecemeal and it won't be ESPN, FOX or CBS. PAC12 Network was a terrible idea in the first place, but the PAC2 are kind of painted in the corner on this, now
If John's numbers are correct about media value of OSU, even including a home game with Oregon, then I don't think fault lies with the Departing 10. There probably should have been some tier of media income within the Pac12 as USC requested. OSU and a couple others probably benefited over a period of years prior to the breakup.
The departing left the conference for greener pastures, knowing full well that OSU and WSU would get left behind in a Pac-12 that had lost all its leverage. Their greed destroyed the conference and materially hurt OSU and WSU.
Which is logical and what the court will also decide. I see no way OSU and WSU aren't going to be able to sue, successfully, for damages, maybe beyond the assets available in the PAC12
I don’t think they knew what would happen to anybody. UW and O didn’t leave just OSU and WSU. The other teams found homes. The PAC-2 didn’t. At some point you have to ask yourself if ur pulling the cart or riding in the cart.
That's a lie and you know it. They were all waiting to see if the other schools would leave also so that no single school looked like the "bad guys." UW and UO only left once they knew that AZ, Utah, and ASU had a ticket to the Big12, giving them cover for their own decision to leave.
There's a lot more to it... when you pool together a bunch of P5 games, you're going to increase the overall value of the package. And you're also adding other sports, particularly men's basketball. The Pac-12's rights (minus USC and UCLA) were worth about $30M-35M. That's what the market would have paid for them.
What you're seeing with that number is a substantial discount due to not being in a conference in any practical sense.
Normally in a conference media deal, the Networks take the best games with the worst sent to the Tier III rights provider, traditionally the Pac-12 Network. Here, the Network would be taking all the games. If OSU goes 4-8 next season, those games arn't worth very much and can't be replaced with other games in a media deal. That has to be factored in. Strength in numbers.
USC & UCLA, I’m told, were about 70% of the households in the PAC-12 media market. If that’s anywhere true, then it stands to reason that the 10 other schools on an equally divided basis reaped benefits for years they could never generate on their own.
The 70 percent belongs to the 10 not including USC/UCLA. Households can be confusing because viewership is more viable to the network's factors. And, USC was a much bigger portion of that 30 percent than UCLA. If, for a moment, you assumed the two LA schools were equal that would be 15 percent, while 10 sharing 70 percent would be 7 percent. So, 11 schools "owed" USC based on that math.
But, from about 2015 to 2021, the rank was USC, Oregon, Stanford, Washington, UCLA. Obviously Stanford has declined and Washington has gone up in media value. UCLA should kiss USC's behind for the BigTen invite.
If you take the often referred to $40M/school in value, and subtract 30 percent for USC/UCLA that is how the "value" got to $28M.
I am really interested in the opportunity the pac12 network represents,as it's a topic that no one really is talking about, yet it is such an obvious long term financial windfall or liability
If the Pac-2 value exposure, they'd best steer clear of ROOT Sports. It's a limited footprint to begin with, and RSN's have a bleak future. I haven't seen a Blazers game in years thanks to ROOT's poor distribution.
They should look to do a deal with someone like the CW. People made fun of the Pac-12 back when they were trying to get a TV deal and that was rumored to be part of it, but I think getting games on OTA channels, even less familiar ones, is going to be more sustainable long term than RSN's. See no further than what a couple NBA teams have recently done (Suns and Jazz).
With the CW already having an ACC game every week, maybe they would like a Pac-2 game to make a doubleheader out of it, assuming OSU/WSU can stagger their home/away games in a way to make it work weekly. It's a small start for both the schools and network, but big things usually have humble beginnings.
John--It has been reported that Jonathon Smith owes OSU $3million for leaving before the end of his contract and the assistant coaches owe $50,000 each. Do the coaches have to pay this out of their new contracts or will MSU pick up the tab? Thomas in Tualatin
The coaches are ultimately on the hook for them. The coaches may negotiate that with their future employer, and often do. But the actual obligation falls on the departing coach.
Cal on the home game list but WSU not? Are the two playing in Pullman for the second year in a row? Or just having a 13th game in Vegas and calling it the Pac-2 Championship Game? Because that actually be pretty hilarious.
I'll say it once again.........CFB is following EXACTLY the model of what has happened to American small business and the power of large American corporations and conglomerates. It shouldn't surprise anyone.
When big money is involved........this is EXACTLY what happens. Much the same with the NCAA, our government is powerless (or involved in the corruption, you choose) and is letting HUGE corporations ruin everything in this country......including CFB. It's the exact same thing.
Thx for a good column John...the issues are very complex....but I’m trying to “understand”it! You keep writing and I’ll keep reading....pass the aspirin!
I need to share my thoughts on Jonathan Smith whenever I can. He left a sinking vessel, abandoning ship is not an admirable thing. It is an easy thing! A selfish thing. He could have stayed one more year, helping OSU get through this mess. He still would have gotten his chance at a Power 5 job. Smith is simply
Evidence of everything wrong in college sports today. No integrity, no honor just greed and more greed.I am sure many support Smith’s decision and I understand the why but I do not accept the why. Smith will be gone in 5 years. He has the personality of a glass of water and so popular here because he played here.
I have tried to stay as neutral as possible in the JS saga, as I try to balance the great job he did in Corvallis with the clunky exit. But has he said or published a single word to Beaver Nation? Any thanks or acknowledgement or farewell? If not (and I haven't seen anything), my neutrality switches to disgust. Even Gary Andersen showed more class on the way out by leaving money on the table. Unbelievable!
The fact that your post shows no loyalty to him is why he is free to show no loyalty to you. Coaches understand that--they're only supported by fans when they give them what they want. You use loyalty in this case like it's a marriage. It isn’t. Just ask a coach who's been fired for not winning enough. Besides all that, what choices did Jonathan have in all this mess? None, he was a victim of decisions he had zero control over and it would've been the same frustrating situation even if he'd stayed. One more year? Yeah, I'm sure fans like you would've then been supportive? No.
I like the idea of the schools keeping the production facility. In fact if I was one of the leaving schools, I would want a piece of the action. After all, outside the conference affiliation, as I understand it, the media operations is a second and separate entity. And what would i do with it? I would offer Pay For View packages. Put the top football and basketball contests out as a Pay For View package or as individual offerings. How many sports fans in the state of Oregon and Washington (alums) would pay? I would also contact other teams across the land and offer to produce Pay For View events for their schools. The catch here of course is centered on one word COMPETENCY. They would have to hire a pro, and I mean a REAL pro at event productions in the Pay For View arena. Look what arena wrestling did with that entertainment giant. It wasn't always a giant. And hire a great announcing team. Why go to ESPN or Fox, they will low ball and use their third string announcing teams. With Pay For View you are not limited to TV sets in rural Oregon and Washington. And the facilities for production are already in inventory. (I doubt i would keep on board any of the present PAC 12 Network management.)
"How many sports fans in the state of Oregon and Washington (alums) would pay?"
Not enough. What shook Colorado, Arizona, UW, UO on the deal Comm K was offering was not just a subscription to view required, but any payment to view. As well as limited exposure on linear TV.
What I wouldn’t give to just be talking about football. *Sigh*
I hear ya.
Ain't that the truth?
I actually find this stuff to be the most interesting content out there. The behind-the-scenes business drama of realignment is captivating.
I am right there with you.
What football is there to talk about right now? NIL and the transfer portal? That's even more depressing
I love the irony: a swimmer, in a non-Rev Olympic sport is who files the multi-billion $$ lawsuit against the NCAA. And just what does he think his damages are? (btw....I was a HS swimmer, so not bias by me)
As long as he can prove someone was willing to pay him for his NIL, he has a case. What really matters is that the case was recently granted class-action status, so this is about much more than just a swimmer now.
The law firm will get rich and everyone else will get peanuts...
Insert Lawyer joke here
Laughing all the way to the bank...
GO DAWGS
(btw, my sister just retired from an attorney at-law career)
Huskies fans and attorneys...fit like a glove.
Go Ducks!!
Ain't that the truth?! I have a friend who does medical class action and he has made a fortune. I think it sucks because he makes 30% and the rest goes to the plaintiffs, but split a thousand ways. He gets a third for just himself and his office. He has several homes and plays golf all day, now. LOL!!
True. And while I have no particular love towards attorneys, litigation isn't cheap. Especially when you are taking on a giant institution that has previously shown it is quite willing and able to drag cases through every level of the courts for years and years (even when it's likely they will lose). As a plaintiff, retaining the legal expertise on your side to take someone like that on is something you'll only get by agreeing that they will get a big cut of any damages you *might* be awarded. You might only walk away with peanuts in the end, but it's better than an empty hand.
I don't think the plaintiffs usually originate the big class actions. A law firm that specializes in liability class actions will spot a trend of injuries and then will advertise for plaintiffs to join the class. I have had several of those invitations (product liability, not medical). Also, the lead law firm usually syndicate the class action to pool resources and be able to market to the class nationally. A law firm does not go this alone. By syndicating, it is the plaintiff attorneys that have the advantage in resources. At the end of the day, it is the public that picks up the tab with higher product or service costs. This is one big reason American medical costs are way more per capita (20% of GDP) than other developed economies (Germany is next at 12%)
I'm sure all of us would prefer to be talking about sports, but I really appreciate your thorough nature on this subject. I feel as if you are reporting things that only you know, and I feel like an Insider as a result.
Thank you Ken.
Keeping the Pac-12 Networks operational has to be a top priority for OSU and WSU. Properly managed, they'll provide a financial life raft for those two schools after getting absolutely F'd by the departing 10. The Pac-12 Networks' current production quality is better than the half-assed garbage put on by Fox or ESPN, and doesn't overbook itself with too many games. Leasing some of those services out to the departing 10 schools, or even the Big-12 conference, can be very advantageous.
Agreed....someone has to produce the games they will sell or syndicate piecemeal and it won't be ESPN, FOX or CBS. PAC12 Network was a terrible idea in the first place, but the PAC2 are kind of painted in the corner on this, now
If John's numbers are correct about media value of OSU, even including a home game with Oregon, then I don't think fault lies with the Departing 10. There probably should have been some tier of media income within the Pac12 as USC requested. OSU and a couple others probably benefited over a period of years prior to the breakup.
The departing left the conference for greener pastures, knowing full well that OSU and WSU would get left behind in a Pac-12 that had lost all its leverage. Their greed destroyed the conference and materially hurt OSU and WSU.
Not sure it was so much greed but survival instinct in comparison to what the 8 were seeing happening in the big 2 to 3.
Which is logical and what the court will also decide. I see no way OSU and WSU aren't going to be able to sue, successfully, for damages, maybe beyond the assets available in the PAC12
I don’t think they knew what would happen to anybody. UW and O didn’t leave just OSU and WSU. The other teams found homes. The PAC-2 didn’t. At some point you have to ask yourself if ur pulling the cart or riding in the cart.
That's a lie and you know it. They were all waiting to see if the other schools would leave also so that no single school looked like the "bad guys." UW and UO only left once they knew that AZ, Utah, and ASU had a ticket to the Big12, giving them cover for their own decision to leave.
Mkay. Also, there was a second shooter on the grassy knoll, Phil Knight is a philanthropist, and the pool boy and ur wife are “just friends”
"Phil Knight is a philanthropist". Crappy. Cheap shot at Phil& Penny Knight. # ignorant
There's a lot more to it... when you pool together a bunch of P5 games, you're going to increase the overall value of the package. And you're also adding other sports, particularly men's basketball. The Pac-12's rights (minus USC and UCLA) were worth about $30M-35M. That's what the market would have paid for them.
What you're seeing with that number is a substantial discount due to not being in a conference in any practical sense.
Normally in a conference media deal, the Networks take the best games with the worst sent to the Tier III rights provider, traditionally the Pac-12 Network. Here, the Network would be taking all the games. If OSU goes 4-8 next season, those games arn't worth very much and can't be replaced with other games in a media deal. That has to be factored in. Strength in numbers.
Truth. Also ... P5 vs. P5 is a bigger value. You'd be adding nine conference games at that tier. Also, men's basketball is included.
USC & UCLA, I’m told, were about 70% of the households in the PAC-12 media market. If that’s anywhere true, then it stands to reason that the 10 other schools on an equally divided basis reaped benefits for years they could never generate on their own.
I had all the market numbers here... https://www.johncanzano.com/p/canzano-pac-12-and-the-rest-of-us
Thanks for this input John. Very helpful in seeing the whole picture.
This link clarifies the "value."
https://archive.ph/bm5gt
The 70 percent belongs to the 10 not including USC/UCLA. Households can be confusing because viewership is more viable to the network's factors. And, USC was a much bigger portion of that 30 percent than UCLA. If, for a moment, you assumed the two LA schools were equal that would be 15 percent, while 10 sharing 70 percent would be 7 percent. So, 11 schools "owed" USC based on that math.
But, from about 2015 to 2021, the rank was USC, Oregon, Stanford, Washington, UCLA. Obviously Stanford has declined and Washington has gone up in media value. UCLA should kiss USC's behind for the BigTen invite.
If you take the often referred to $40M/school in value, and subtract 30 percent for USC/UCLA that is how the "value" got to $28M.
I am really interested in the opportunity the pac12 network represents,as it's a topic that no one really is talking about, yet it is such an obvious long term financial windfall or liability
The networks could be a cash rescue fund if they can line up productions.
If the Pac-2 value exposure, they'd best steer clear of ROOT Sports. It's a limited footprint to begin with, and RSN's have a bleak future. I haven't seen a Blazers game in years thanks to ROOT's poor distribution.
They should look to do a deal with someone like the CW. People made fun of the Pac-12 back when they were trying to get a TV deal and that was rumored to be part of it, but I think getting games on OTA channels, even less familiar ones, is going to be more sustainable long term than RSN's. See no further than what a couple NBA teams have recently done (Suns and Jazz).
With the CW already having an ACC game every week, maybe they would like a Pac-2 game to make a doubleheader out of it, assuming OSU/WSU can stagger their home/away games in a way to make it work weekly. It's a small start for both the schools and network, but big things usually have humble beginnings.
Comcast recently put Root into the premium package, at least in Eugene.
Thanks for more good information John. . It will sure be refreshing when the ratio of questions to answers reverses what it is now.
For sure.
John,
Good post.
Thanks
John--It has been reported that Jonathon Smith owes OSU $3million for leaving before the end of his contract and the assistant coaches owe $50,000 each. Do the coaches have to pay this out of their new contracts or will MSU pick up the tab? Thomas in Tualatin
The coaches are ultimately on the hook for them. The coaches may negotiate that with their future employer, and often do. But the actual obligation falls on the departing coach.
It's pretty standard that the coach's new employer picks up any buyouts owed to their previous school.
Cal on the home game list but WSU not? Are the two playing in Pullman for the second year in a row? Or just having a 13th game in Vegas and calling it the Pac-2 Championship Game? Because that actually be pretty hilarious.
I'm assuming its in Corvallis... but let's see.
Is it possible OSU & WSU could combine to offer themselves to a broadcast partner? It is late night inventory for the taking.
Don’t hate it. Every couple of mil helps. Night games though.... might hurt ticket sales. The net result may not be worth it
I'll say it once again.........CFB is following EXACTLY the model of what has happened to American small business and the power of large American corporations and conglomerates. It shouldn't surprise anyone.
When big money is involved........this is EXACTLY what happens. Much the same with the NCAA, our government is powerless (or involved in the corruption, you choose) and is letting HUGE corporations ruin everything in this country......including CFB. It's the exact same thing.
Thx for a good column John...the issues are very complex....but I’m trying to “understand”it! You keep writing and I’ll keep reading....pass the aspirin!
Wow! Who knew that the Civil War would be a premiere event and not the OSU vs. WSU game.
Rob, lose a home gave vs a P4 opponent to go on the road to play in a Band Box stadium and make money for an entity that is suing you? SCHMUCK!
I need to share my thoughts on Jonathan Smith whenever I can. He left a sinking vessel, abandoning ship is not an admirable thing. It is an easy thing! A selfish thing. He could have stayed one more year, helping OSU get through this mess. He still would have gotten his chance at a Power 5 job. Smith is simply
Evidence of everything wrong in college sports today. No integrity, no honor just greed and more greed.I am sure many support Smith’s decision and I understand the why but I do not accept the why. Smith will be gone in 5 years. He has the personality of a glass of water and so popular here because he played here.
I have tried to stay as neutral as possible in the JS saga, as I try to balance the great job he did in Corvallis with the clunky exit. But has he said or published a single word to Beaver Nation? Any thanks or acknowledgement or farewell? If not (and I haven't seen anything), my neutrality switches to disgust. Even Gary Andersen showed more class on the way out by leaving money on the table. Unbelievable!
The fact that your post shows no loyalty to him is why he is free to show no loyalty to you. Coaches understand that--they're only supported by fans when they give them what they want. You use loyalty in this case like it's a marriage. It isn’t. Just ask a coach who's been fired for not winning enough. Besides all that, what choices did Jonathan have in all this mess? None, he was a victim of decisions he had zero control over and it would've been the same frustrating situation even if he'd stayed. One more year? Yeah, I'm sure fans like you would've then been supportive? No.
His time was now, not after a 4-8 season next year. It sucks. I don’t blame him tho
To quote a line from 70% of the Law & Order reruns:
“You don’t understand...I needed the money”
GO DAWGS
I like the idea of the schools keeping the production facility. In fact if I was one of the leaving schools, I would want a piece of the action. After all, outside the conference affiliation, as I understand it, the media operations is a second and separate entity. And what would i do with it? I would offer Pay For View packages. Put the top football and basketball contests out as a Pay For View package or as individual offerings. How many sports fans in the state of Oregon and Washington (alums) would pay? I would also contact other teams across the land and offer to produce Pay For View events for their schools. The catch here of course is centered on one word COMPETENCY. They would have to hire a pro, and I mean a REAL pro at event productions in the Pay For View arena. Look what arena wrestling did with that entertainment giant. It wasn't always a giant. And hire a great announcing team. Why go to ESPN or Fox, they will low ball and use their third string announcing teams. With Pay For View you are not limited to TV sets in rural Oregon and Washington. And the facilities for production are already in inventory. (I doubt i would keep on board any of the present PAC 12 Network management.)
"How many sports fans in the state of Oregon and Washington (alums) would pay?"
Not enough. What shook Colorado, Arizona, UW, UO on the deal Comm K was offering was not just a subscription to view required, but any payment to view. As well as limited exposure on linear TV.
Inside stuff. Love it John. Thanks