Related to a previous comment, why does no one mention the Portland TV market when discussing the $$ value of the ducks or the Beavs? I know Portland is not LA or even Denver, but there's probably more OSU and UO grads in the Portland area than in Corvallis and Eugene, which is what they seem to look at.
John is mentioning the markets aside from Portland cuz he’s a Portland writer and it obviously goes without saying. Portland clearly counts in the numbers.
Good point. I think they are struggling to value the Ducks....because they are a national brand. Hell I know folks who recently went to Europe sporting their Ducks gear and heard GO DUCKS! several times in thick Scottish and British accents.
We are being severely undervalued in this whole thing. We don't need the midwest or the south to be successful. It is pathetic to think this. The west coast of the US is one of the most progressive geographic regions on earth today. Let's use that fact to create our own reality......not ride the coat tails of the old fashioned.
TV likes winners and this is why the Ducks have some better TV ratings. When the winning ceases they will be at the back of the pack. Nebraska had a huge national following for decades and when they entered the Big 10 they landed like a thud.
The ducks and uncle phil need to face the reality they're not the national brand or market they think they are. They still seem to recruit well, or brag how they do, but not producing on the field or court.
They are more a national brand than USC and UCLA, pretty much any way you slice it. Certainly regarded as a bigger brand by recruits. And Oregon football generates more revenue than either USC or UCLA's program.
I have always despised the LA schools just for rivalry reasons but U$C a smaller Nat brand than Or ? Really ? Even UCLA is a bigger brand. Both of their history, academic standard, Alumni base are alot bigger than the Ducks. Since the '94 Pick, the Green and Yellow brand has been expanded wonderfully and worldwide but they need the Wins as that National brand is only 28 or less old. They are getting there and Lanning is a great pick as a young coach on his way up. UCLA, Stanford and U$C have been the west coast National brands for over 100 years, and the Cougs, just kidding.
Football aside...that would be pretty incredible for basketball, both recruiting, and ticket sales. Football not so much...Clemson< Oh yeah....FSU...mmm Ok... Wake forest? North Carolina? Syracuse? yawn. But if it opens those area's to more exposure and recruiting then yeah go for it. There just aren't many if any pluses for the PAC members going to the big 12.
WF, Pitt, BC, Clem, UNC, Duke, FSU, Mia, GT, Louisville would be great stadiums to visit, tradion and atmosphere like OSU and WSU but 100years more history and tradition. Hell with the Big 10. Syracuse in the fall would be cool IF they had an outdoor stadium. ACC fits our Academic wants and we would not be thought of as the athletic dept at the bottom rung of the ladder. I like it better than Ames Iowa or Manhatten Kansas, Lubbuck TX, Baylor Tx, yuk.
USC and UCLA will, in fact, get some more media money. But they’re going to lose out on some recruits. The reason CU wanted to move to the PAC-12 is that their recruits wanted to play on the West Coast more often. USC and UCLA will end up in the same boat in a few years, and it’ll cut into their ability to recruit (especially UCLA, who isn’t remotely a powerhouse).
Imagine bringing UNC and Duke to Eugene and Corvallis for basketball games every-other year. It could make the Pac-Ten a premier basketball conference again. Wouldn't that be cool!
Washington DC would be part of the ACC market, not Big XII. West Va is not close enough to DC to warrant calling DC a Big XII market. Sacramento, Portland and Tucson markets are also valuable to PAC12
John, thanks for years of entertaining articles. Did Commish Thompson give you any other pertinent Pac 10 schools media rights perceived value ? Like Stanford, UCLA, $C, UW ??
Looking a bit into the future, at what point do the Big two conferences start discarding their own members? Aka, Vanderbilt, Mississippi State in the SEC or Minnesota, Illinois in the Big10 for other schools? Would the Big10 really prefer to have Minnesota and Illinois rather than Oregon or Washington?
One can imagine that happening in some sort of PAC-12/BIG-12 merger. Although more likely it's just the BIG-12 taking who they want from among the desperate PAC teams.
The best and most realistic scenario for the PAC12 would be to merge 8 schools with the Big 12 and form the first 20 team superconference and beat the Big 10 and SEC to the punch. That's where they're headed anyway.
As necessary as it may be, I absolutely hate the idea of Oregon in the Big Ten. A merged Pac-12 and Big 12 (which would be eight) could... could... have some clout. America's too damn big to have just two super conferences. And, when all these mergers are dissolved anyway for one 40 or 48 team super conference with four divisions, Oregon would be in a better position. I think. I hope.
The ACC partnership is a good move--way better than a Big12 one, imo. But I still think Oregon will hitch its wagon to the Big10 if they open the doors, regardless of their share. PK will subsidize--he's a competitor.
Agreed. Oregon is not going to be part of Big 10. Fox guy says its $30M value, UCLA/USC are getting at least $75M, so there you go. Each team takes a pay cut to let the Ducks in? Not gonna happen.
This is an awful idea. I’m from the Twin Cities. The idea of adding a West Coast team to the Big Ten just sounds foreign as hell. It’d be an awful branding move for UO.
Yes, and it’s a total money grab (for both sides) that makes no sense from any other perspective - rivalries, travel schedules, recruitment, etc.
There isn’t a league in the USA this geographically spread out and that includes the pros. The idea that it’s somehow good that USC, Rutgers, and Wisconsin are somehow better together than USC with Stanford, Washington, or Cal is just dumbfounding to me.
Other than pure, top-line dollars - and the deal won’t look as good on *net* - this is a dumb move.
I'll miss the tradition aspect, too, but USC will maintain their two biggest rivals: ND and UCLA. Money move, yes, the engine that now drives CFB. These kids are "semi-pros" now and we haven't even gotten into the full implications of treating athletes as employees, unions, etc. It's coming.
You can include Portland as a market that the Pac-X covers 😂, what percentage of your readers are Oregonians? High I’d presume. I’ve never understood why you Oregonians have such an inferiority complex
Related to a previous comment, why does no one mention the Portland TV market when discussing the $$ value of the ducks or the Beavs? I know Portland is not LA or even Denver, but there's probably more OSU and UO grads in the Portland area than in Corvallis and Eugene, which is what they seem to look at.
Denver and Portland are pretty comparable:
Portland Metro:
Pop: 2.5 million
Portland–Vancouver–Hillsboro, OR–WA Metropolitan Statistical Area:
Pop: 2.75 million
Portland - Vancouver - Salem Combined Statistical Area
Pop: 3.2 million
Denver-Aurora-Lakewood metropolitan area:
Pop: 2.97 million
Denver–Aurora combined statistical area:
Pop: 3.6 million
True. And Salem has to be counted as Portland metro. And ESPN knows this btw, it was just left out by John in a passing comment.
John is mentioning the markets aside from Portland cuz he’s a Portland writer and it obviously goes without saying. Portland clearly counts in the numbers.
You’re right. Portland counted. I’ll include in future posts. Good point.
Good point. I think they are struggling to value the Ducks....because they are a national brand. Hell I know folks who recently went to Europe sporting their Ducks gear and heard GO DUCKS! several times in thick Scottish and British accents.
We are being severely undervalued in this whole thing. We don't need the midwest or the south to be successful. It is pathetic to think this. The west coast of the US is one of the most progressive geographic regions on earth today. Let's use that fact to create our own reality......not ride the coat tails of the old fashioned.
TV likes winners and this is why the Ducks have some better TV ratings. When the winning ceases they will be at the back of the pack. Nebraska had a huge national following for decades and when they entered the Big 10 they landed like a thud.
Correct. Somehow Portland supports the Blazers and Timbers but OMG UO is doomed without the Big Ten is a total laugher.
Sorry. I just don’t see it.
You're laughing, I think, because you don't quite understand what's happening.
Educate us, Obi Wan...
I think the ACC and Pac-12 partnership would be great!
The ducks and uncle phil need to face the reality they're not the national brand or market they think they are. They still seem to recruit well, or brag how they do, but not producing on the field or court.
They are more a national brand than USC and UCLA, pretty much any way you slice it. Certainly regarded as a bigger brand by recruits. And Oregon football generates more revenue than either USC or UCLA's program.
I have always despised the LA schools just for rivalry reasons but U$C a smaller Nat brand than Or ? Really ? Even UCLA is a bigger brand. Both of their history, academic standard, Alumni base are alot bigger than the Ducks. Since the '94 Pick, the Green and Yellow brand has been expanded wonderfully and worldwide but they need the Wins as that National brand is only 28 or less old. They are getting there and Lanning is a great pick as a young coach on his way up. UCLA, Stanford and U$C have been the west coast National brands for over 100 years, and the Cougs, just kidding.
USC and UCLA moved because they’re in LA. That’s it.
How likely is it that the up and coming Beavers get left in the dust, with a newly renovated stadium? Keep us updated on any noise you hear!
Beavers need a conference.
I don't think that stadium being renovated does them any particular good in this situation.
Football aside...that would be pretty incredible for basketball, both recruiting, and ticket sales. Football not so much...Clemson< Oh yeah....FSU...mmm Ok... Wake forest? North Carolina? Syracuse? yawn. But if it opens those area's to more exposure and recruiting then yeah go for it. There just aren't many if any pluses for the PAC members going to the big 12.
WF, Pitt, BC, Clem, UNC, Duke, FSU, Mia, GT, Louisville would be great stadiums to visit, tradion and atmosphere like OSU and WSU but 100years more history and tradition. Hell with the Big 10. Syracuse in the fall would be cool IF they had an outdoor stadium. ACC fits our Academic wants and we would not be thought of as the athletic dept at the bottom rung of the ladder. I like it better than Ames Iowa or Manhatten Kansas, Lubbuck TX, Baylor Tx, yuk.
How would it be good for other sports? Trying to make this make sense...
Making my call:
USC and UCLA will, in fact, get some more media money. But they’re going to lose out on some recruits. The reason CU wanted to move to the PAC-12 is that their recruits wanted to play on the West Coast more often. USC and UCLA will end up in the same boat in a few years, and it’ll cut into their ability to recruit (especially UCLA, who isn’t remotely a powerhouse).
This is short-term gain, long-term pain for them.
Please, no more alliances. The Pac-12 needs to grow eyes in the back of its head, lest it get stabbed there again.
Focus regionally. Set a vision, then see it to reality. Adjust your finances accordingly.
You mean: get left out of the money and media coverage, watch recruits lose interest, and then adjust our expectations accordingly?
Imagine bringing UNC and Duke to Eugene and Corvallis for basketball games every-other year. It could make the Pac-Ten a premier basketball conference again. Wouldn't that be cool!
It works.
Nope. Not buying it. We go from organic rivalries to one-off games from across the country.
In the same conference is not one off, and its really not that much different than the Big 10 distance
Good thing Jeff is you don't need to go.
It’s a huge distance difference, my friend, especially when you factor in the travel times from most of these cities.
Washington DC would be part of the ACC market, not Big XII. West Va is not close enough to DC to warrant calling DC a Big XII market. Sacramento, Portland and Tucson markets are also valuable to PAC12
John, thanks for years of entertaining articles. Did Commish Thompson give you any other pertinent Pac 10 schools media rights perceived value ? Like Stanford, UCLA, $C, UW ??
" ... ACC vs. Pac-12 championship game in Las Vegas at the end of the season. ..."
Wooho.
Who could possibly give 2 small turds about that?
Looking a bit into the future, at what point do the Big two conferences start discarding their own members? Aka, Vanderbilt, Mississippi State in the SEC or Minnesota, Illinois in the Big10 for other schools? Would the Big10 really prefer to have Minnesota and Illinois rather than Oregon or Washington?
One can imagine that happening in some sort of PAC-12/BIG-12 merger. Although more likely it's just the BIG-12 taking who they want from among the desperate PAC teams.
The best and most realistic scenario for the PAC12 would be to merge 8 schools with the Big 12 and form the first 20 team superconference and beat the Big 10 and SEC to the punch. That's where they're headed anyway.
The ACC option is 10x better.
The ACC schools are also good schools.....and the Big 12 schools are not so good as educational institutions. Just reality.
What ACC option, exactly? Schedule some games? Some imaginary championship toilet bowl game in Vegas? A loose agreement?
As necessary as it may be, I absolutely hate the idea of Oregon in the Big Ten. A merged Pac-12 and Big 12 (which would be eight) could... could... have some clout. America's too damn big to have just two super conferences. And, when all these mergers are dissolved anyway for one 40 or 48 team super conference with four divisions, Oregon would be in a better position. I think. I hope.
It’s not necessary. This is groupthink. People need to pause, strategize, then act.
The ACC partnership is a good move--way better than a Big12 one, imo. But I still think Oregon will hitch its wagon to the Big10 if they open the doors, regardless of their share. PK will subsidize--he's a competitor.
Agreed. Oregon is not going to be part of Big 10. Fox guy says its $30M value, UCLA/USC are getting at least $75M, so there you go. Each team takes a pay cut to let the Ducks in? Not gonna happen.
This is an awful idea. I’m from the Twin Cities. The idea of adding a West Coast team to the Big Ten just sounds foreign as hell. It’d be an awful branding move for UO.
You do know the BIG10 already accepted 2 west coast teams right?
Yes, and it’s a total money grab (for both sides) that makes no sense from any other perspective - rivalries, travel schedules, recruitment, etc.
There isn’t a league in the USA this geographically spread out and that includes the pros. The idea that it’s somehow good that USC, Rutgers, and Wisconsin are somehow better together than USC with Stanford, Washington, or Cal is just dumbfounding to me.
Other than pure, top-line dollars - and the deal won’t look as good on *net* - this is a dumb move.
I'll miss the tradition aspect, too, but USC will maintain their two biggest rivals: ND and UCLA. Money move, yes, the engine that now drives CFB. These kids are "semi-pros" now and we haven't even gotten into the full implications of treating athletes as employees, unions, etc. It's coming.
You can include Portland as a market that the Pac-X covers 😂, what percentage of your readers are Oregonians? High I’d presume. I’ve never understood why you Oregonians have such an inferiority complex
Please don't feed the trolls.
I love trolls.
I imagine you love yourself....A LOT.